: BILL MARSH/ November 21th, 1999

   
13:30 - 14:00
[13:29] Djuna hello cybele(?)
mIEKAL kicked out when I tried to backchannel
[13:30] billseye funny, with DISGRUNTLED gone, i feel more at ease -- just a word thing, miekal, nothing personal ;)
Surd I'm looking at Tidal Vision also.
mIEKAL originally I wrote in DISGRUNTLED INTERNET USER, but it only displayed the first letters.
[13:31] billseye sorry beth -- but in the context of "TidalVision," and with all that ebb & flow ...
mIEKAL I'm wrestling with technology today.
David the change of frame is interesting. I think it works best when it's small.
Djuna bill, can you talk about this piece? where does it come from?
mIEKAL give me the url youse is looking at, I can't run g2 tho
echo teasing you, bill:o)
[13:32] Surd http://www.sunbrella.net, link from there directly.
billseye miekal, was thinking of you when putting all this up -- realizing you can't view it -- stay tuned for narrative voice-over...
David If it were big, like a Bill Viola, the experience would be so immersive that we wouldn't catch the frame-in-frame.
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echo my connection is too lousy to view
billseye "TidalVision" started with the idea of sampling TV off local cable (San Diego) every day at the time of the low and hi tide markers (one minute at each point, about 4 samples per day), during the entire summer of 99 -- my friend/partner and i went through and took 5-10 second chunks and spliced them together, then laid the whole thing next to this repeating shore image -- so, on the right, ocean tide, on the right, frantic "channel surfing"
tompur moofy got me
Surd Yes, mine garbles it quite badly also.
[13:34] echo it won't run, too slow a speed
echo uswest really blows...:o(
Surd What emerged for you out of that sampling, Bill?
billseye that would be the "other right"... -- ocean image on the right, tv samples on the left
David maybe you could do an animated gif version
Surd I did that too for radio, really instructive.
Djuna hmm, I'm only seeing one screen
[13:35] Surd What recurred or highlighted itself?
David the web version is two images superimposed, claire
[13:36] billseye claire, should only be one screen -- i was talking about the original piece -- then, for the web, i condensed it to 6 minutes, really just pulling segments that i liked and that were particularly "stressing" since the emerging theme seemed to be a lot about stress -- and then superimposed the two
Djuna that I got a sense of - actually I was very enthralled by that manipulation of the image - what's the center?, what am I seeing?, what do I want?
billseye jim, a lot of televangelism and weight-loss programs and ads
[13:37] David and the channels were chosen randomly?
billseye yes, david, using a random # generator i found on the Web
Djuna culture (pop) vs. the world ..
echo i say 'poop culture'
billseye the plan is to run more streaming audio and video off this main page -- working with Claire right now to install a piece (what we saw last week, Claire, or a new version) incorporating html and real streaming
tompur Tidal Vison is a really cool idea . . . What if you could somehow view a surfaholic's web browser unbeknownst to them and do a (W)eb (E)bb (B)eacon . . . and show those clips from a web browser along side the tides . . . did that make sense?
echo yes!
echo it rocks!
[13:39] Surd Yes, when I sampled I noted the concentration on money, not just in the types of programs you mentioned.
billseye and money too, yes, everywhere
tompur certainly sounds shifty enough, eh beth?
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[13:40] echo nice shot! umph...take that tpur!
  tompur <whap> ouch
[13:41] Surd Do you want to move to another piece of yours, Bill?
reiner ... have to leave .... time to sleep here .... see you .... reiner ..... ciao
Surd Bye, Reiner!
tompur bye reiner
mIEKAL bye reiner.
David ...and the frenetic pace of the commercial programs
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David adios amigo
Djuna so Bill, you mean/want to concentrate on broadcast art as opposed spoken word/audio poetry? That seems all it's really been used for by web artists (that I've seen)
[13:42] billseye see you reiner -- jim, sure, maybe something in the "works" section of "btheater" -- http://www.sunbrella.net/btheater/pastworks.html
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mIEKAL claire, doesn't spoken work fit within the notion of broadcast art?
mIEKAL in your mind
[13:43] Djuna this is really rich because it's a short film that has an intimacy and immediacy that is lacking on the big screen - I feel closer, shall we say
[13:44] Djuna but, though I don't really know much about it, isn't that written first - as for another media(um) initially, and later rendered into sound?
billseye right, claire -- i have nothing against using the stream for spoken word, which (why not) is another way to "get it out there" -- but i'm personally interested in playing against TV as the dominant broadcast medium, and with this streaming technology we have opportunities for that -- so, i'm more interested in using it for this kind of broadcast feedback than for archiving recordings of spoken word, for example -- though at the same time, we're planning to put up video samples from our local "Beyond the Page" reading series
  Djuna like making print text into hypertext vs. hypertext composed for the medium itself.
Djuna correct me if I'm wrong
[13:45] echo no wrong here, claire, just dif. views
Surd Sampling and such concatenation can really highlight and expose a bigger TV picture.
[13:46] David yeah, TV is a good source of material. And we have the tools now to play with it.
mIEKAL bill, have you found any software which allows one to perform live using a microphone, midi, etc that works well for you.
Djuna (I have to learn about this ...)
[13:47] mIEKAL a media mixing console, so to speak..
Surd I found that, in doing radio, to sample the sounds of TV and then work with it for radio introduced a bizarrely rich soundscape into radio...
billseye meaning a spoken word recording is just that -- a rebroadcast -- it's not perfect, but i'd like what we put up to be primary somehow, not a re-showing of something else -- though at the same time it does appropriate a foregone signal -- that's why i prefer the term broadcast-feedback
[13:48] Djuna it's such an antipathy after the last few days of experiencing Bill's "Drops"
billseye i haven't tried it, but from what i understand, with the free RealProducer you can run a live broadcast using nothing but a computer mike -- the problem is (1) quality and (2) having or finding a server to serve the stuff
echo what about telepoetics, bill?
Surd To take one medium and work with parts of it in another can be very far from shovelware.
[13:49] billseye go on, beth...
echo ok..
[13:50] echo well, kurt and martha
echo and electrolit
echo in canada are doing
echo those live connectiuons
echo across the continents
echo live video
[13:51] echo like video conferencing
echo poetics
echo .
Surd It is video conferencing.
echo would this be something to explore?
mIEKAL beth, can any browser receive it or what do you need to see it?
echo or am i way off base here?
Surd Special software and hardware.
echo remember i'm a heathen to tech
[13:52] echo if you are interested, miekal
Djuna it doesn't seem the technology is really up to it yet - I tried to view a Derrida talk in Australia, and i actually saw/heard about 15 minutes out of hours of talk.
echo will dig around
Surd Only the participating hookups participate, can't get it through a browser.
echo yes
mIEKAL ah
  echo but there has been talk of
  echo putting something in place
echo to change that
[13:53] David what about something lo tech with web cams?
billseye electrolite sounds cool -- seems to be a lot of room for play in this area
echo there you go...!
mIEKAL I'd be happy to do something like stream an ascii film thru a chat like this...
echo what a great idea!
Surd You can do that, actually.
echo web cams..
billseye miekal, i remember you mentioning that -- how would that work?
Surd If you have mIRC or Ircle.
mIEKAL why couldn't it be put thru this chat the way it is ?
Surd it can.
Surd If it's a .txt file.
echo web cms?
Djuna I'm still curious about the 'drops'...
[13:55] mIEKAL so you input a text file?
Surd Yes, what are you doing with 'drops', Bill?
Surd Yes, Miekal.
mIEKAL & could we all make an ascii montage by input such files?
Surd yes.
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Djuna they are so ... harmonious amidst the cacaphony of web "flash"
tompur moofy is after me today
[13:56] mIEKAL ewww, claire, you got me..
billseye oh, sorry claire -- not wanting to say much about it right now in the early going, but i'm thinking of the "drops" sequence as a different kind of streaming, i guess -- or a different kind of "dynamic html", behaviors slowed down, over time -- a lot depends on response, which i'm getting some of ;) -- also, obviously, it's (e)mail art
Surd Are you writing them as you go?
[13:57] billseye the wise make no promises...
David you're planning, what, 81 episodes? How did you arrive at that?
Surd 3 cubed
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